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Author Topic: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!  (Read 3420 times)

electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #60 on: November 26, 2017, 11:38:45 AM »

Just a quick update as BBC News has been referring to drone regulation this morning - basically nothing much to report.

https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2017-19/droneregulation.html

http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/CBP-7734
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #61 on: November 26, 2017, 01:02:19 PM »

That first link refers to “A Bill to regulate the purchase and use of drones weighing 5 kilograms or more; and for connected purposes.”

So I may have missed something previously, is there a separate bill for under 5kg?




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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #62 on: November 26, 2017, 03:02:34 PM »

That first link refers to “A Bill to regulate the purchase and use of drones weighing 5 kilograms or more; and for connected purposes.”

So I may have missed something previously, is there a separate bill for under 5kg?


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Well spotted that man! Not sure about this one. I also see that it is classed as a private members bill. My understanding is that the new regulation was coming from the DfT.
I'll have to look into this as most of us sit in the > 250g <5kg category.
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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #63 on: November 26, 2017, 04:42:56 PM »

Perhaps it’s in addition to the DfT bill? 5 kg is heavy for a quad not so much for a fixed wing.


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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #64 on: November 26, 2017, 08:54:28 PM »

I still haven't got to the bottom of this 5kg or more but it suggests commercial operations.

However what I have found is that the Flying High Challenge, funded by the government and run by Nesta in partnership with Innovate UK, is set to launch tomorrow (Monday, 27 November) when cities will be invited to register their interest.

Nesta is the National Endowment for Science, Technology and the Arts and you can find out more on their website of Wiki.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nesta_(charity)

There's also more from the Government about this Flying High Challenge.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-powers-for-police-to-address-illegal-and-unsafe-use-of-drones

Now here's a rather telling quote from Aviation Minister Baroness Sugg from the above link.

"These new laws strike a balance, to allow the vast majority of drone users to continue flying safely and responsibly, while also paving the way for drone technology to revolutionise businesses and public services."

Apart from jumping the gun because she is really talking about something in the future so she should say "will strike" my emboldened words tell us a lot about where the push is coming from.

Also rather interesting is :
"Police officers will use all available powers to investigate reports of criminal misuse of drones and seek the appropriate penalty. Make sure you know the rules for using a drone because it is always your responsibility to ensure that you are acting within the law and in line with the Civil Aviation Authority’s Drone Code."
I wonder how many Police officers are aware that whilst the Drone Code restricts flights to below 400ft, our FPV exemption limits us to below 1000ft.  Last year I brought this up at a drone conference with licenced operators and ARPAS-UK who would not believe me until I downloaded the exemption and they read it for themselves.
I have also brought this up with fellow non FPV model flyers who, despite proof of the exemption, insist that 400ft is the limit for FPV and non FPV models. This despite proof from CAP 658 that the 400 ft limit does not apply to models under 7kg. Further discussion was fruitless because they could not give a source for this misinformation, but still believed it.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2017, 09:17:14 PM by electrotor »
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BigT

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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #66 on: November 26, 2017, 09:18:54 PM »

And here https://www.arpas.uk/government-funding-for-the-flying-high-challenge-drone-services-in-cities/

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And if we needed any further evidence :

"Drone-based systems could revolutionise how goods and services are delivered and advance cities’ broader goals around transport efficiency, economic opportunity and innovation."
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #67 on: November 26, 2017, 10:52:32 PM »

And
“Police forces are aware of the ever increasing use of drones by members of the public and we are working with all relevant partners to understand the threats that this new technology can pose when used irresponsibly or illegally. Do not take this lightly – if you use a drone to invade people’s privacy or engage in disruptive behaviour, you could face serious criminal charges.

Police officers will use all available powers to investigate reports of criminal misuse of drones and seek the appropriate penalty. Make sure you know the rules for using a drone because it is always your responsibility to ensure that you are acting within the law and in line with the Civil Aviation Authority’s Drone Code.”

I am a bit confused now as we now seem to have the word Drone used consistently but all the statements seem to refer to multicopters. Previously drone referred to all UASV and UAV. In fact the word Drone is now the EU legalspeak for UAV etc.


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« Last Edit: November 26, 2017, 10:57:34 PM by BigT »
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Steve W

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #68 on: November 26, 2017, 11:31:31 PM »

Quote from: Electrotor
I have also brought this up with fellow non FPV model flyers who, despite proof of the exemption, insist that 400ft is the limit for FPV and non FPV models. This despite proof from CAP 658 that the 400 ft limit does not apply to models under 7kg. Further discussion was fruitless because they could not give a source for this misinformation, but still believed it.

At that point, the onus is on them to disprove what you're saying - so by default, you win the debate.
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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #69 on: November 27, 2017, 12:54:10 AM »


I am a bit confused now as we now seem to have the word Drone used consistently but all the statements seem to refer to multicopters. Previously drone referred to all UASV and UAV. In fact the word Drone is now the EU legalspeak for UAV etc.


I have been droning on about definitions for years now and despite correspondence with the CAA, DfT and Airprox Board they do not have a common definition. A clear definition will have to be stated in any legislation in order for it to be understood and effective. Unless this is done, my definition of drone may not be the same as those charged to enforce the regulation, ie the Police. They surely have enough to do already without chasing reports of drones, when those reporting may have yet another definition. And how they hope to measure 400ft is anyone's guess. Actually you could do it by straight line distance and angle if you had the gear, but then it would have to be regularly calibrated to be admissible, just like speed cameras. Sigh!
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #70 on: November 27, 2017, 09:53:07 AM »

We did it like this when I was in the Scouts in the 60’s http://scoutmastercg.com/how-scouts-measure-height/


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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #71 on: November 27, 2017, 10:11:38 AM »

We did it like this when I was in the Scouts in the 60’s http://scoutmastercg.com/how-scouts-measure-height/


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Trees don't move around a lot, well not in my experience; and they only change height on a seasonal timescale. However camera equipped fixed wing (is it a drone or not?) just won't stand still long enough. Pesky things!
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