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Author Topic: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!  (Read 21993 times)

ORCA

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #75 on: January 16, 2018, 01:18:44 PM »

Xjet reported on this a week ago. Probably correct as the UK gov didn't want to reveal the reports contents.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0gOxuyr438
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BigT

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #76 on: January 16, 2018, 04:26:12 PM »

Yes I watched that. Interesting info on the accuracy of the info on the App but not surprising.  How many web sites do you come across in May saying Happy Christmas? Its the same issue.  The info center that updates AA roadwatch is huge but thats never 100% either.
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Steve W

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #77 on: January 16, 2018, 08:03:31 PM »

In theory the app could be accurate if they would sync NOTAMs in real-time but I'm guessing it's still under development
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #78 on: February 06, 2018, 10:30:23 AM »

Searching around the old inter web I came across this post . https://phantomcockpit.com/2018/01/12/drone-laws-in-germany/

http://www.bmvi.de/SharedDocs/EN/Articles/LR/clear-rules-for-the-operation-of-rules.html

Seems a lot less restrictive than our DfT proposals but you will need a pilots licence for models over 2kg.

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« Last Edit: February 06, 2018, 10:34:15 AM by BigT »
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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #79 on: February 07, 2018, 12:06:33 AM »


http://www.bmvi.de/SharedDocs/EN/Articles/LR/clear-rules-for-the-operation-of-rules.html


The German definition

What is a “drone”?
A “drone” is an unmanned aircraft. Aviation law distinguishes between unmanned aerial systems and model aircraft. In accordance with Section 1 of the Civil Aviation Act, unmanned aerial systems are devices exclusively used for commercial purposes. Model aircraft are devices used for private purposes, i.e. for sporting or recreational purposes.
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #80 on: February 07, 2018, 12:18:11 AM »

Did you see the contradiction in items 2 and 3 for certificate of knowledge? I think it’s in the translation. In 2 it means a test for operating knowledge and in 3 it’s for knowledge or notification of operation.
I contacted the BMFA today to ask if there is an agreement that my BMFA B cert will be recognised as I am planning to go and fly at several events in Germany this year, big gliders and aero tugging. I was told that they don’t have any agreement in place, I probably will need to register, fix fireproof alloy reg plates on the models and pass the test on German Air Law, in probably in German, but my BMFA insurance would be OK if they accepted it. Looks like I will be staying home. Haven’t checked France yet, we where going to Interex as well.


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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #81 on: February 10, 2018, 11:14:47 AM »

So an update for anyone following this thread.

In Oct 2017 Germany brought in new laws to govern radio control and free flight model flying to comply with EASA regulation.

There is a “proof of competency” certificate. Which is in the form of a multi choice test taken on line. Once passed you pay your money and download the cert. I believe the cert lasts for 5 years. (This is a much better idea than the current BMFA system of leaving the standard of answer up to the local club examiner. I would like to see the German system adopted here).
If you hold any form of full size aircraft license that is enough.

A complete distinction between commercial and hobby activities was made.  It depends on the intended use of the craft. If it’s hire or reward it’s a UAV. If it’s a hobby it’s Flight Model Aircraft. 
There are weight categories: over 250g up to 2kg, 2kg to 5kg, 5kg upwards.
All FMA must have a fireproof label of a specified size mounted outside.
FPV is limited to LOS and has strict height and distance restrictions.
Under 14’s must have adult supervision if outside a registered club.
Insurance is mandatory.

Link to English translation https://www.kenntnisnachweis-modellflug.de/FAQ?changelanguage=2.

EDIT

Just received this link from the BMFA. Pages 8,9 and 10 are of interest
https://www.bmfa.org/Clubs/Club-Bulletins?EntryId=2450


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« Last Edit: February 10, 2018, 12:57:27 PM by BigT »
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electrotor

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #82 on: February 10, 2018, 01:10:08 PM »

So an update for anyone following this thread.

Just received this link from the BMFA. Pages 8,9 and 10 are of interest
https://www.bmfa.org/Clubs/Club-Bulletins?EntryId=2450


Certainly a lot better than many of us feared would happen.
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BigT

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #83 on: February 10, 2018, 02:52:32 PM »

I can imagine the members reaction in some clubs in my area that already have a "Gestapo" member on the committee ready to take action against a reported infringement.

Several of us examiners always thought that the current testing schedule was wrong. Currently its, flight, then if thats a pass its 5 out of the 20 compulsory questions, if thats a pass its on to 6 or 8 general questions.  Every time you take an achievement test the questions are asked again. It just puts most folks off. the compulsory questions should be online,  done first and last for a set period of time. Like the German system.  What I dont know is if the BMFA etc will accept the on line test as part of the requirement.   
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ORCA

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #84 on: February 10, 2018, 05:12:44 PM »

That would suite me as I have a PPL + IMC + night.
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Steve W

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Re: Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #85 on: February 10, 2018, 11:34:58 PM »

One interesting part I saw was:

Quote
UAS.SPEC.055 Responsibilities of model clubs and associations
Model clubs and associations that hold an operational authorisation defined in Article 6 of
this Regulation shall:

... take appropriate action when informed that a registered member does not comply
with the conditions and limitations defined in the operational authorisation and, if
necessary, inform the competent authority;


Does this imply that members of an association (say FPVUK) should basically watch their backs because posting on a forum such as this one requires the association to inform the CAA of any transgressions? And what if they don't - will they be considered irrelevant due to choosing not to help enforce regulations?

« Last Edit: February 10, 2018, 11:37:13 PM by Steve W »
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #86 on: February 11, 2018, 10:43:35 AM »

I think you are right in that assumption. I thought that was particularly acute and basically it’s a snitches charter. I saw on another forum that the FAA have a whole department that do nothing except scan you tube for misdemeanours and contravention’s. Probably why there’s such a huge hole in the federal budget.


From my understanding of the way it works in Germany the “club” is an organised flying site registered with the FAO and run accordingly. I have flown at some German club site and they are truly fabulous. Usually funded in part by the Gemeinderat, (local council) with brick buildings and proper runways. There is a registered flight officer who would be responsible for ensuring the laws are upheld. I don’t think it’s the same when the organisation has no registered site. In those cases the full licensing of the UAV pilot is enforced. For example the glider meet I am planning to attend  will be at a farmers field up in the Alpine Region and will have a Luftfahrtbundesamt (federal aviation officer) in attendance.


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« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 10:48:02 AM by BigT »
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BigT

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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #87 on: February 11, 2018, 10:52:49 AM »

I have asked the BMFA Achievements Officer  the following question.

In the event that the DfT creates an on line certification certificate, which will be obtained by a candidate registering and completing a multi choice questionnaire similar to the current program being run in Germany, will that certificate of competency be accepted by the BMFA as satisfying the current compulsory questions part of the achievement program?
Still not had an answer. I expect the answer to be no, but I may be pleasantly surprised.

This is the current German system https://www.kenntnisnachweis-modellflug.de/FAQ

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« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 11:19:44 AM by BigT »
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« Reply #88 on: February 13, 2018, 09:23:03 AM »

Answer from BMFA development officer back today, short version, “ to early to say but probably no as every pilot should know legal situation every time they fly”. So the CPC would be good enough to last 5 years for the DfT bit not for the BMFA. Not so the LMA who posted this https://forum.largemodelassociation.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8139


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Drone Debate in Parliament - includes Shakespeare quotes! Yep!
« Reply #89 on: February 15, 2018, 08:45:54 AM »

Just for general interest, here are the final rules for operating Leisure and Commercial UAV in Iceland. http://www.icetra.is/aviation/drones/


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