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Author Topic: UK Drone Registration Scheme  (Read 2457 times)

BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #60 on: June 05, 2019, 10:49:10 AM »

1) no you’re not
2) That’s the German system that’s been in place since July 2017 and is working well
3) The “logic” applied is user pays the bill, but is fundamentally flawed as it is based on an operational cost of £2.8 million pa divided by expected registrations in 3 years rising to plus 250,000 which is pure bollocks. We would be knee deep in model airplanes.

I got the impression that Peter Jones has more than a finger in this pie. Also worth noting that commercial operators and remote pilots will need to register as well as pass the existing licence test. I asked if the figures included remote pilots flying a commercial quads. IE all police officers registered to fly a constabularies “drone”. They didn’t know but that could be where the figures been plucked from. The feed back was that  as the cost of a rod licence, drivers licence, passport, senior railcard, etc was much higher people will pay.

And themCAA/ DfT have still not given up on the idea of pre flight registration via an app and transponders.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 10:50:48 AM by BigT »
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ched

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #61 on: June 05, 2019, 06:07:06 PM »

3) The “logic” applied is user pays the bill, but is fundamentally flawed as it is based on an operational cost of £2.8 million pa divided by expected registrations in 3 years rising to plus 250,000 which is pure bollocks. We would be knee deep in model airplanes.

I got the impression that Peter Jones has more than a finger in this pie. Also worth noting that commercial operators and remote pilots will need to register as well as pass the existing licence test. I asked if the figures included remote pilots flying a commercial quads. IE all police officers registered to fly a constabularies “drone”. They didn’t know but that could be where the figures been plucked from. The feed back was that  as the cost of a rod licence, drivers licence, passport, senior railcard, etc was much higher people will pay.

And themCAA/ DfT have still not given up on the idea of pre flight registration via an app and transponders.
There is no way the scheme should cost anywhere this amount. Someone is either pulling the wool over the gov eyes or making millions for their mates!!! There numbers are as you say in cloud cuckoo land.

The test is purely so if anyone is caught breaching the rules and has passed the test the gov have a very easy job proving they knew they were doing something illegal.

Any Gov personnel will have an exemption. Otherwise the Police will have to spend thousands of their budget to another gov department. Plus they have all had gov approved training to be responsible for their flights haven't they?

As for the comparisons:
Rod licence = doesn't a gov department manage public waterways, so surely the costs of looking after the system should be considered as part of the £30 a year rod licence.
Drivers Licence = £21.50 for 10 years!!!!
Passport = £75.50 again 10 years!
Senior Railcard (why senior?) but that's £30 but saves you 33% on every trip you use it on. So only 1 ticket over £100 and it's zero cost!!!

So their comparisons are flawed, then again this whole stupid thing is just a pre cursor to the gov selling off airspace for profit. I read somewhere the other day that unmanned air borne taxis are coming!!!!

Not having a go at you just venting, sorry.
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electrotor

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #62 on: June 06, 2019, 12:05:14 PM »

I found the layout hard to follow in places, especially when they mix up "Drone" "Model Airplane" "RC Toy". Illustrations where of "quads" no fixed wing, gliders etc.
They seemed amazed that they should just call the system " SUA Owner and Pilot Registration" and forget the word Drone, take it out completely.

So the CAA's Drone Registration Scheme applies only to multicopters, as graphically differentiated from model aircraft on their own website. Glad they cleared up this confusion.

« Last Edit: June 06, 2019, 12:17:24 PM by electrotor »
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BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #63 on: June 06, 2019, 12:46:07 PM »

Thats exactly the page used for the into to the test but with a few extra links. Trust me I did make the point that it should just be called SUA registration and testing and IF there was to be any illustration then please show ALL SUA it applies to.
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electrotor

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #64 on: June 06, 2019, 01:41:36 PM »

Thats exactly the page used for the into to the test but with a few extra links. Trust me I did make the point that it should just be called SUA registration and testing and IF there was to be any illustration then please show ALL SUA it applies to.

"M'lud, according to the CAA this odd looking thing with arms is a drone and therefore the Drone Registration Scheme and Drone Code apply.
However, my client, the accused, operates something rather more elegant and which we all recognise as a model aeroplane.
I therefore submit that he has no case to answer."

"Agreed, case dismissed."
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BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #65 on: June 18, 2019, 08:33:47 AM »

So a club mate went along to the testing session yesterday and reports back the following changes.
I did the model flying registration run through this morning. It seems to have moved on a lot and been clarified and simplified since Tim did his. The terminology is more consistent and only talks of “drones and model aircraft” as a single term and not separating them.
The test was 40 questions with a pass mark of 35, can take as many times as you like and should take 20 minutes.
I was still confused over some bits but they’re definitely taking feedback and implementing changes.
Next stage is a beta rollout to 1-2 thousand users before live beginning October. I was asked if I wanted to be part of beta if opportunity came up.

I sat the "exam" at the end of the session and passed with flying colours. You'd have to be a complete idiot to fail it, although the source of the questions must have been the ANO, they are written in everyday laymans lanuage with multiple choice answers, I had to sign my life away, so in theory I'm gagged (mm nice). but if it were the driving test, they would be similar to: At what colour traffic light do you stop? a)Red, b)white, c)flashing purple. There were no model prep questions. There still is some confusion over operator/flyer which they are working on.
I think the intention is that as a flyer, I pay my registration and its valid for 3 years. So its quite affordable, they want the money out of the commercial operators and their pilots, not from us. But it gets confusing because its not clear if I am an operator if I test fly your model, as the model has your number on it and is not owned by me.

In addition I can inform that they are visiting  a very large model club near me, 150 plus members,  to run through the system at a club meeting to get feedback.
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BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #66 on: June 18, 2019, 08:37:14 AM »

“I think the intention is that as a flyer, I pay my registration and its valid for 3 years. So its quite affordable, they want the money out of the commercial operators and their pilots, not from us. But it gets confusing because its not clear if I am an operator if I test fly your model, as the model has your number on it and is not owned by me. “

If that’s the case I fail to see how the 170,000 rising to 250,000 registrations @ £16:50 each needed to cover the cost of the program will happen.
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FPVSteve

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #67 on: June 18, 2019, 09:15:24 AM »

If the test is so simple that even I can pass it, what's the point of it?

This seems like something to ensure people say "I understand not to fly stupidly" rather than anything to do with safety. If that's the case, it's purely a way to nail people in court, i.e. "you knew what you were doing - look, you took our test".

Nice.
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BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #68 on: June 18, 2019, 09:52:37 AM »

Steve, that’s correct and that’s exactly what my old law tutor used to say at least once a week. “ laws are in place to enable punishment to a degree and to maintain discipline and control of the populous and prevent anarchy.” 
« Last Edit: June 18, 2019, 10:20:48 AM by BigT »
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CurryKitten

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #69 on: June 18, 2019, 10:08:39 AM »

This seems like something to ensure people say "I understand not to fly stupidly" rather than anything to do with safety. If that's the case, it's purely a way to nail people in court, i.e. "you knew what you were doing - look, you took our test".

That's exactly what it is - none of this "I didn't know the rules" business.  Also the difference between an operator and owner (or whatever it was) leaves them able to take action against someone in the chain

BigT

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #70 on: June 18, 2019, 10:28:42 AM »

That's exactly what it is - none of this "I didn't know the rules" business.  Also the difference between an operator and owner (or whatever it was) leaves them able to take action against someone in the chain

A second point that is not discussed quite so much is the new policing powers that are to coincide with the new legislation. However the private members “drone bill” which was due for its second reading in Feb.  2019, is still in limbo. I eagerly anticipate what actions will be taken against Extinction Rebellion when or if they carry out the disruption of Heathrow etc.
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urbanfpv

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #71 on: June 18, 2019, 12:39:09 PM »

Extinction rebellion aren't going to take any action.

See here:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-48652840

electrotor

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Re: UK Drone Registration Scheme
« Reply #72 on: June 18, 2019, 02:38:01 PM »

However this all pans out it's still like farting in the face of the various modelling organisations who have done much over the years to encourage a culture of safe and responsible flying by "proper" safety award schemes, training etc.
The government's half baked attempt involves no training, no actual flying test, an idiot based on-line test and they want you to pay for it too. And this will make flying safer?
Clobber the idiots who have brought this knee jerk reaction about, using existing legislation and encourage people to join modelling organisations.  The current legislation isn't broken so doesn't need fixing. It's the attitude and basic ignorance of those pushing for this new legislation that needs fixing.
Rant over.
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