So, I figured no reason not to start just because I've not even got any of the kit in my hands yet!
Seems I've got off to a spectacular start having ordered some 2.4Ghz radio gear which Coyote has kindly set me straight on, so will be making some phone calls nice and early tomorrow morning to stop that going out the door.
Still, I think I can be fairly confident the Easy Star was a decent choice.
Planning on documenting the learning process as well as possible here and on fpv.org.uk (http://fpv.org.uk) (just picked the domain up today).
Dont get me wrong you can use 2.4ghz gear, but you cant use 2.4 fpv equipment with it limiting you legally to 1.3ghz or 5.8ghz and limited range too.
What everyone on 2.4ghz rc control ends up doing is buying a 35mhz system afterwards. Seeing you dont have yours yet i`d skip the finding out the hard way step and get 35mhz straigh off the mark
Cant go wrong with an easystar :)
Quote from: Coyote on November 15, 2010, 12:08:14 AM
Dont get me wrong you can use 2.4ghz gear, but you cant use 2.4 fpv equipment with it limiting you legally to 1.3ghz or 5.8ghz and limited range too.
Got it. ;D
Going on your summary over on the main site it seems like 35mhz with 2.4ghz seems like the best overall choice. At least for the first time around.
After looking into all the different things to consider (OSD, RTH, telemetry) I'm slightly leaning towards just facing the fact that it's probably unfeasible to aim for the 'perfect' choice of gear first time, so I'm ready for the fact that I might find myself eBaying some bits along as I make different choices, upgrade, etc.
Given I've got no background in 'ordinary r/c' I'm guessing it's going to take a while to get proficient so I'm just going to take it all slowly and enjoy the whole process. :)
Ah no rc experiance says then to learn to fly first using the EZ with no FPV gear. Its really easy, after a few weeks of flying you will be throwing it all around the place
Then use the KISS method. Keep It Simple Stupid.
For a first FPV platform forget about all the toys, they need a lot of thought to mix and match, positioning has to be well thought out for interference.
If you have a problem at the start and you have fitted loads of gear its very hard to pinpoint the problem too. If you crash ( which you will, we all do lol ) the bill for replacing all these parts can cripple you.
Basically, a camera, video transmitter and thats it on the plane.
On the ground, receiver and goggles. You dont need anymore to start with. Get use to flying close in. Once you have it in the bag then and only then start considering a complicated system.
I spent a fortune and lost a fortune until i learnt to do it that way. Worked out miles better on the wallet :)
Definitely learn to fly LOS first, you can start slowing acquiring FPV gear in the meantime. 2.4ghz is definitely the best choice for video basically because it's widely used for lots of different applications so it technically further advanced.
Listen to Ian, that advice is sound!
Yep, complete noob here :)
Well, apart from when I was a kid but that was like 15 years ago and I never even managed to go solo. Still, the memory's clear enough to appreciate how nice it is to have decent motors and batteries, not to mention bendy foam fuselages!
So sounds like I can just forget about OSDs, etc for now, which is honestly a big relief - think I'll just, like you say, use this one for learning line of sight and nearby fpv when I progress on, then maybe start fresh with a new model when I'm ready to progress onto something more adventurous.
Sounds like I can probably not worry about brushless motors, etc and just stick with the standard for the time being.
Right, alarm goes off in about 6 hours so better hit the sack.
Night chaps, thanks for the warm welcome and great help.
:)
Your most welcome matey, on brushless motors though i`d still use them, the stock easystar 6v motors a load of rubbish, put in a 2200kv black mantis or Turnigy etc for LOS flying and maybe fpv, i personally go bigger for the extra fpv weight but others find 2200kv no problem at all :)
I completely agree with Coyote about the motor and cannot understand why the likes of Multiplex persist with clanky old brushed motors. However beware of Multiplex supplied brushless tuning kits. They are VASTLY overpriced. Giantcod, Robotbirds and BRC are but three suppliers of sensibly priced brushless motors and escs.
For the same power output brushless is lighter and more efficient. This mean you save a small amount of weight and your flight times are longer for the same battery pack. My Twinstar motors stayed in the kit box and I converted to brushless during the build.
If you haven't already purchased the Easystar you might like to consider the AXN Cloud aka AXN Floater. It's cheaper and comes complete with servos, brushless motor and esc. Robotbirds or BRC can supply. I am nearing completion of one (converting for night flight) and the kit quality is very good. The instructions are rubbish but there's not much building. Flight reports of it are good.
Well, unfortunately the place I picked to order my stuff from is shut on Monday and Tuesday, and I'm going to be in the middle of nowhere with no internet or mobile access from tomorrow until Thursday (sounds like a good place to take a model plane actually!).
Hope they check their mail as I guess that's my only hope for stopping this order.
Ahh, ok, I'll start checking out motors, etc.
Cheers again guys :D
Quote from: electrotor on November 15, 2010, 01:48:16 PM
If you haven't already purchased the Easystar you might like to consider the AXN Cloud aka AXN Floater. It's cheaper and comes complete with servos, brushless motor and esc. Robotbirds or BRC can supply. I am nearing completion of one (converting for night flight) and the kit quality is very good. The instructions are rubbish but there's not much building. Flight reports of it are good.
Interesting. OK, well if I find myself cancelling my order completely I'll take a look at them too - sounds like a sensible choice.
I didn't want to use the brushed motor to power the plane but did make use of it by pulling out the guts and using the can as a motor mount and bolting a Hyperion Brushless from Robotbirds inside the can. I use a high kv motor similar to a heli spec motor becuase of the need for plenty of revs with the limited prop diameter.
The motor can clearly fits into the pod without any modifications and will ease out if I decide to change the motor in the future.
There are lots of options!
Quote from: Waikawa on November 15, 2010, 07:38:41 PM
There are lots of options!
Almost feels like too many options right now!
OK, back from a couple of days in Scotland - back on with the project.
The radio gear order has been stopped successfully, and now that I've looked on eBay I see it shouldn't be too hard to find something nice and cheap there.
Found this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Futaba-FF7-Computer-Radio-2-receiver-2-sets-xstal-/290500306909?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item43a32ae7dd) auction and wondering if it's a good buy?
A bit of searching and have seen the T7CP recommended so that looks good, not sure about the receivers though. Still, I also saw a guide price of £80 for the tx alone so surely it's not a bad deal.
Thats a good price that, same tx as i use so i can highly recommend it.
Watch the price though, they tend to sky ocket towards the end of bidding. £80 quids a good price for tx alone too :)
Awesome, thanks for the speedy reply mate - since there's only a few of those on eBay atm and the BIN price was OK I just went ahead and took it.
Nice one, very good transmitter, easy to uhf, head trackings no problem on it either :)
So, Easy Star is sorted and should be arriving at my office on Monday, with the radio gear hopefully some time in the week.
Next up - battery / charger / motor / esc.
Following on from a chat with Coyote in the shoutbox last night I'm heading towards the following:
- A couple of Zippy Flightmax 2200mah lipos (from storm_trade on eBay)
- A Turnigy Accucell 6 (again from storm_trade)
- Black Mantis 2200kv inrunner from GiantCod (he suggested 2200kv but 2700 was the nearest I could find)
Still lost for the choice of esc though.
And as of 30 seconds ago, that's my Advanced Flight Box on it's way from firstpersonview.co.uk :)
10 x Hextronic HXT900 servos purchased from HobbyKing.
Let's see if they're not the last thing to arrive through my letterbox.
Were they in stock ?
Seems so!
Also just ordered an Accucell-6 charger - their shipping is cheap enough that I'm not too bothered about trying to get things into a single order to try and save on it.
Thinking now though if i'm going to be waiting x weeks for this to turn up maybe I might as well order lipos from them, since they seem so much cheaper than buying in the uk.
They just have so damn many to choose from!
OK, has to be done - obligatory post just to break that 20 post threshold.
It looks like "Mode 1", can they be converted?
Yep - think it's quite straight forward - change the functionality via the settings, then pop it open and switch a spring and friction plate to convert the sticks.
To swap modes, hold down, mode and end while switching the Futaba 9 on. Then select mode 2 in menu.
Then swap the spring over from one gimble to the other and your done :)
OK, that's the lipos, battery, motor and esc on it's way.
After last night's (possibly unwise, post pub) decision to use HobbyKing I've now placed a third order with them. After thinking I made an incorrect assumption about the postage, it does look like I've paid about the same amount for 3 packages as I would've done for one. And possibly the smaller packages might have less likelihood of running into trouble at customs.
Got a couple of Zippy Flightmax 2200mah lipos as planed, but went with a Turnigy HXT 2835 as Giantcod are out of the 2200kv Black Mantis inrunners atm and I'd seen that being used in the ready to go fpv package that were on sale a little while back.
They were also out of most of their ESCs so I've got a Turnigy Plush 25a coming from eBay.
So that, I think, is most of the big stuff sorted.
Might invest in a simulator too - can keep me entertained while I wait for everything to arrive too. :)
Where are the lipo`s getting shipped from ? Not hong kong i hope. They will take over a month ;)
Yes a sim is a great idea, in fact the best. Get to know your bird before you have even got to the field :)
Quote from: Coyote on November 20, 2010, 05:30:32 PM
Where are the lipo`s getting shipped from ? Not hong kong i hope. They will take over a month ;)
Unfortunately, yes.
I decided on HXT900 servos after I saw your recommendation, then saw the warning at HobbyKing about the quality of the ones you find on eBay, etc (bs, you think?) so decided to buy them from them.
After that, I felt like I'd committed myself to waiting for them to arrive anyway so, having also been lured by their cheap prices, decided I might as well get some more stuff from them.
HXT900 Servos are HXT900`s same thing, just bs really. I`ve bought them from all over, same quailty.
For me now, Hobbyking to me is false ecomony. You wait that long for bits to come into stock, if 9 out of 10 of your items are there they will not post till the other item comes in. You wait over a month for some orders. I just but the same gear for a fraction of the cost more in the uk and get everything within 2 days.
Quote from: Coyote on November 20, 2010, 05:49:45 PM
HXT900 Servos are HXT900`s same thing, just bs really. I`ve bought them from all over, same quailty.
I did think that might be the case. Once again, should've asked about here. :+
Quote from: Coyote on November 20, 2010, 05:49:45 PM
For me now, Hobbyking to me is false ecomony. You wait that long for bits to come into stock, if 9 out of 10 of your items are there they will not post till the other item comes in. You wait over a month for some orders. I just but the same gear for a fraction of the cost more in the uk and get everything within 2 days.
So have your problems been pre-dispatch? Because at least mine appear to have gone out for delivery quickly enough.
But yes, you get what you pay for - if this turns into a complete mare I won't be all that surprised.
No lipo problems are universal with everyone, they ship them different now. The rest yes, pre-order, if everythings not there its 50/50 when new stock come in so your order just sits there
Oooh, toys are arriving.
Need more hands to carry all the boxes back from the office though.
:D
Nice one what have you got ? :)
The EasyStar and tx turned up yesterday but I wasn't unfortunately stranded at home. Then the video stuff from Simon just arrived this morning.
Can't wait to get home to open everything up.
:)
Wow, exciting times! ;D
its a great feeling ...isnt it ?
Heh, yep, I've honestly not been as excited about a new pastime or looked forward to anything quite as much for a long time!
;D
You will learn to love and hate the postman, he can bring you much joy, and plenty of heartache :)
Quote from: Coyote on November 24, 2010, 12:40:53 AM
You will learn to love and hate the postman, he can bring you much joy, and plenty of heartache :)
:laugh:
Can't do a great deal until my HobbyKing stuff turns up, but thinking about sorting out the rudder and aileron mods in the meantime. Would love to be able to get all the main parts glued together so I can start running around my flat holding it up in the air making wooshing sounds.
For the rudder mod I'm thinking rather than making a new one from a separate piece of foam or balsa (neither of which I have to hand) I might just cut it as it is then reinforce the thinner area where you're meant to cut out the original rudder, then attach that.
I'm also wondering about the hinge. Again, I don't have any hinges to hand but I saw Coyote used some sort of webbed packing tape for his (over actual hinges though). Maybe I'm getting too scrappy here, but I'm wondering how bad it could be to use good old duct tape.
Actually, as I type this I'm realising the reason having actual hinges is good - if it was only taped I could see problems it being pulled away where the tail fin and rudder meet at a point to allow space for movement.
Hinges it is then, but I'm imagining duct tape could still be good?
You dont have to hinge the control surfaces with actual hinges, strong tape will do fine as long as it holds well. Tape both sides and you wont have a problem, i`d choose other tape than duct tape myself but even in emegencies ive used cellotape lol :) I`d not rush i, get the right stuff and have it look nice not thrown together :)
I just prefer the added security of real hinges too. But ive seen and had plenty that didn`t, its personal preference.
I wouldnt be in too much of a hurry to glue the fuse up, once it is its a bugger to get to anything or replace. You might want to shift equipment round for your CG adjustments too. What i do is just have the fuse masking taped together.
Thanks for the pointer on not gluing the fuselage. I was thinking (originally for fixing servos in) about possibly going with some sort of hole drilling + cable tie approach. Sound alright?
I've got to wait a bit to get hold of glue, etc, so I guess I might as well order me up some hinges. Any particular reason to pick one type over another?
Blenderm tape is good for hingeing foam. It's also lighter and more pliable than some of the heavier duty packing type tapes. Several model outlets now stock it.
http://robotbirds.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=3033 (http://robotbirds.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=3033)
To hlod the servos in, put masking tape on the rear housing of the servo and hot glue in place. That way if you strip any gears and need them back out you can get them back out without wrecking the EZ.
Hinges : any really, i used simple tape hinges on some, just as good as the others. The tape i use is from staples, its clear glass fibre reinforced packaging tape
Cheers guys, have ordered some reinforced tape off a eBay.
I've got to get some connectors, etc for wiring up all the electrics so I'll get the hinges with them.
Also need to find something to make a rudder out of. There's a branch of ModelZone I can get to during my lunch break so I'll probably take a wander up there and see if I can buy a small piece of balsa.
So, got my first package from HobbyKing - ordered 19th Nov, dispatched next day, arrived 30th - not bad at all.
My second order was placed and dispatched on the same days so was hoping it'd arrive at the same time, but can't be too far behind.
The third order was a couple of days after that so hopefully will be here in the next week or two (no doubt will be delayed by the snow though).
you dont need fancy tape for hinges, particularly not on a slow foamy. many of my models including very fast composite dynamic soaring models have unbranded sellotape type tape :)
the great thing about tape compared to actual hinges is it seals any gap between the ron and wing.
Still working on this, still lurking here :-)
Been taking my time, learning about things as a I go. Also seem to have developed a bit of a multicopter habit which I can see taking over a little in the future.
Hehehe Mikes going to be thrilled another multicopter convert lol
We will take over the world :laugh:
Lol, there's something really quite addictive / moreish about them!
I read that guide on rcexplorer.se and by the end of the night had an order on it's way from HobbyKing which is now with me (need to go by wood tomorrow!), but have since bought a couple of frames from Jakub over in Poland not to mention a KK controller and a wii motion plus.
:-)
I am planning to port some of my HG stuff over here as there is some usefull stuff in there. So you building a 4 gyro Tri or something more umm "refined"?
Mike.
My plan is to do it proper ghetto for the first one - diy wooden frame, standard heli mixing, 4gyros, etc. I'm a complete noob so I can see myself crashing and fixing that for a while before moving on.
Then for the two frames from Jakub - I bought one of his mini tricopters and foldable quad, so I'm planning a multiwii for one then a kk for the other - not sure which will be which yet....
Ace! that is just the path to take. The very basic 4 gyro setup teaches you so much about how and why these things work, the rest then becomes so much simpler.
I have umm a "few" of Jakubs frames and they are great. I have both of the Tri's and his G10 quad. All are very well thought out and the parts are nicely finished.
For FPV the Tri's are just the business, and they are so robust and cheap to fix when it all goes rather horrid.
Looking forward to your build thread Jon :)
Mike.
Haha, yes, I've seen your other threads - sort of looks like a possible vision of my future :D
Are there many other folks selling frames?
I've seen a few about but Jakub seems the only guy who's established enough for you to take the convenient path of watch video on vimeo > google > website > paypal > frame delivered a week later. I've seen people mention others but they all seem to involve just PMing people on rcgroups.
Jakub I have found to be a very good supplier and has umm values which means he sticks by his product and wont promise something he can't deliver. He is running a "professional" business and there are a few others who are starting to see the light.
I have purchase a couple of frames from averticalview.com who do some nice stuff, and dt8666 is starting out and has a proven track record. One of the things in RCG is you need to be carfull treading the line between informing, and selling which is why the private messages is path a lot of people take.
I have also purchase for joecnc who does some nice G10 work but model side is not his primary business so can take a bit of a back seat, but still nice stuff none the less.
The you have people like mimso kim who openly sells stuff on the web based around the developement work done in the forums. Bit pricy on postage, (IMO) but gives good service and has developed the code which he has returned to the forum.
Mike.