Just found this http://www.bevrc.com/chainlink-uhf-long-range-system-p-84.html (http://www.bevrc.com/chainlink-uhf-long-range-system-p-84.html)
Also on You Tube http://www.youtube.com/user/alishanmao#p/u/2/4J4zpY06mvE (http://www.youtube.com/user/alishanmao#p/u/2/4J4zpY06mvE)
More UHF options?
Check out his other FPV equipment reviews.
yes it that is on my list to get aswell chris r on here has just bought one would be interesting to see his review on it ,,
I was one of the first who ordered it as soon as it became available last Monday night, it has cleared custom's today and should be delivered by Parcelfarce tomorrow :D (this will be my 4th order from BECRC and all have arrived in around a week, very impressed)
It will be going in my Bormatec Maja and hopefully I will get test it at the weekend.
Nice one, cant wait to hear some results, by the sounds of it this is a beta system, so you might be the guinea pigs ;)
FEDEX always get caught, it depends on if they admit value or gift on the box. If the values high its going to get slammed :(
Once my customs fee was $50 quid from Fedex, not sure on the others
Turns out BEVRC have cancelled my order and have not refunded me. there ignoring all the emails and paypal dispute. :(
Oh no, that doesnt sound good, wonder what they are playing at ?
He now saying paypal cancelled the order, nevermind will go with dragonlink and wait. :)
How strange chris ...oh well dragon it is then lets hope you have better luck
Probably for the best, already have the DOSD+
is this system even legal in the uk??
just ordered mine :) let you know how it goes
oh, so... does everyone just use them anyway im assuming that everyone who has said the are buying one?.. what are the conssequences should the police come poking around, im assuming that nobody really gives a toss as its a harmless activity?
no you need a ametur radio licence to use this at all???
Just been checking the tracking for the CL when a van pulls up outside - woohoo!! it's xmas time :D
Ordered mine on 11/4 (B13 ordered his on the 10/4 and it arived yesterday) and got it today.
Ordered the 1/2 wave aerial, as an extra. It seems a little 'floppy' (oer miss's!) plus its got a touch of 'brewers droop' from being curled up in the box - perhaps I'll see if the other half can make it a little straighter and stiffer(nudge, nudge, wink,wink).
Time for a little bench play and then put it in an existing LOS electric model for some confidence building use.
Got my chainlink couple days ago. easy to install and setup on a turnigy 9x.
But my video transmitter has very reduced range vs using 35mhz. :(
Quote from: g1ass on April 10, 2011, 10:48:51 PM
oh, so... does everyone just use them anyway im assuming that everyone who has said the are buying one?.. what are the conssequences should the police come poking around, im assuming that nobody really gives a toss as its a harmless activity?
no you need a ametur radio licence to use this at all???
yes you would need a licence to use these and it would have to be 459mhz as far as i'm aware for the uk
The conssequences are OFCOM would be knocking on your door so unless you have an ametur radio licence leave we alone and stick to the 35mhz or 2.4 ghz and stay legal
i sent mine back, faulty, bev said i could have a replacement but just asked for a credit instead as i want to stick with 35 mhz, 1K is enough distance for me and my spotter is knocking on a bit, got a nice cam there i'll get instead
Couldnt agree more bignose, im too scared of losing expensive kit to let it out of sight. 35mhz is more than enough for what i want lol
Guys: You may not be aware of the forum rules (which have recently been re-emphasised due to problems with OFCOM and the CAA Enforcement Branch). We can't allow discussions about equipment which is not legal for use in the UK, or of flying that is not in full compliance with the Air Navigation Order. Whilst its certainly not illegal to talk about such things, it is illegal to use them and it has become clear that a number of anti-FPV busybodies are prepared to take technical discussions from here and use them against our members, our community as a whole and our sport/ hobby. We are now aware of complaints having been made to both OFCOM and the CAA regarding FPV by these people.
The Chainlink system is entirely illegal for use in the UK. Whilst 433MHZ is an ISM band (Industrial, Scientific, Medical - IE licence free) overseas, unfortunately it is not in the UK. And that's a bit irrelevant anyhow because the chainlink is too powerful to be operated in the ISM band.
How would they catch you? "They're" pretty good at it. And probably when you're least expecting it :-) Most likely you'd interfere with a local Amateur Radio Repeater (which I believe use 433MHz for their "backhaul" in the UK). The HAMs would then complain to OFCOM and take it as a challenge to find the source of the interference (they are radio HAMs after all, triangulating a source of interference is all part of the fun, and they have a legal right to use the frequency whereas you do not). Then they'd report it to OFCOM who would make your day a very bad one.
We already know of one model club reporting one member here to OFCOM due to misconceptions on radio frequencies. Its just not worth the risk. 35MHz with a Corona RP8D1 receiver will give you up to a maximum of 1.5kms. That's as far, or beyond, as far as the eye can see and therefore as far as you are allowed to FPV by law.
And regarding flying beyond LOS; that is the limit set out by the Air Navigation Order. Non-Compliance with that could end very badly as well. Again we're now aware of a CAA Enforcement Branch investigation into a UK FPVer (not an FPV UK member).
All the best
Simon
Whole heartedy agree with you Simon.
As a Radio Amateur myself, I can tell you it would take no time at all to find someone with a transmitter, in fact it's regularly a fun activity to 'foxhunt' http://www.radiofoxhunt.co.uk/ (http://www.radiofoxhunt.co.uk/)
You really do not want to upset the Amateur Radio fraternity (as well) as they have a right to the 70cm band (430-440MHz band) and will surely assist in tracking down illegal transmissions that is causing interference to their frequencies and enjoyment of their hobby.
It's a shame that the allocated UHF frequncy allowed for airborne models (459MHz) is not currently supported by any commercial manufacturer - http://www.ukrcc.org/459mhz.html (http://www.ukrcc.org/459mhz.html)
We should actively try to get this band supported by manufacturers for model control rather than using illegal frequencies.
More useful info - http://www.ukrcc.org/index.html (http://www.ukrcc.org/index.html)
Nigel.
Surely, with a 'Ham' ticket I can legaly use the 'CL' (low O/P ***mW, high O/P ***mW, FHSS 433mHz-435mHz)?
The full licence parameters table (Table C page 20 of 23) states that I am allowed to transmit with a status of secondary user at upto 400W in this frequency range.
Or, have I got this wrong???
I don't know anything about electronics/frequencies etc - but it would seem that with such little difference in the frequencies - the general way they work would be the same? Is that right?
What I'm trying to say is that surely - to someone who knows and builds these things - the slight frequency difference wouldn't mean reinventing the wheel? Right or not?
If only we could get this idea off the ground. If it is a genuine usable frequency that would work for longer distance and more importantly perhaps for security of your connection with channel hopping or whatever it's called then it would be fantastic if we were to make it happen somehow.
With recent activities and aggro - maybe we should try somehow to start this going seriously. I wonder if the open source LRS that is due out any time would easily adapt to 459mhz?
Its fairly easy to do, but the demand is so low. Even if every member here was happy to buy one, thats only 300 units. Of course this type of system could be used by LOS flyers too. If they were interested then the demand would sky rocket and maybe a manufactorer would do a UK spec model.
I'm very pleased to say that FirstPersonView.co.uk supplies all its EzUHF units on 459MHz and one hundred mW.
The firmware came through very recently and our versions all ship like this. :-)
Here's the link: http://www.firstpersonview.co.uk/rc-control-systems/ezuhf-459mhz-fhss-robust-digital-rc-system (http://www.firstpersonview.co.uk/rc-control-systems/ezuhf-459mhz-fhss-robust-digital-rc-system)
Quote from: ORCA on April 23, 2011, 01:21:00 PM
Surely, with a 'Ham' ticket I can legaly use the 'CL' (low O/P ***mW, high O/P ***mW, FHSS 433mHz-435mHz)?
The full licence parameters table (Table C page 20 of 23) states that I am allowed to transmit with a status of secondary user at upto 400W in this frequency range.
Or, have I got this wrong???
Devonian: Do you know how this works? Are hams just allowed to transmit using any of the HAM frequencies if they have the ticket or do the band plan "reservations" have to be stuck to? EG if 433MHz is reserved for repeaters, can a HAM use that frequency for model control?
Its not airborne so it shouldn't be out on that count.
Simon,
Intersting on the Immersion 459MHz - I didn't realise the firmware had been updated.
As for using my Amateur Radio licence to transmit RC control at 433MHz, it's certainly 'bad practice' to transmit incorrect modes outside of the recognised band plan and would surely get me hunted down by my fellow enthusiasts as it's used by the national repeater network.
I really don't want to go there as the 459MHz allocation is there and available for RC airborne use.
I don't know the rules and regs inside out and why bother when 459MHz is available?
Nigel.
Quote from: Devonian on April 24, 2011, 11:17:52 AM
Simon,
Intersting on the Immersion 459MHz - I didn't realise the firmware had been updated.
As for using my Amateur Radio licence to transmit RC control at 433MHz, it's certainly 'bad practice' to transmit incorrect modes outside of the recognised band plan and would surely get me hunted down by my fellow enthusiasts as it's used by the national repeater network.
I really don't want to go there as the 459MHz allocation is there and available for RC airborne use.
I don't know the rules and regs inside out and why bother when 459MHz is available?
Nigel.
The new firmware came through VERY recently. My begging and pleading with ImmersionRC for the last 2 years or so finally paid off!
I did also ask the Dragonlink boys and I think I asked Thomas Scherrer but from memory neither of their systems were capable of changing frequency to that degree without major reworks.
The question about 433MHz was for ORCA. He already has the Chainlink system and he wonders if its legal for use. I guess the answer is probably; if you really do have an Amateur License , but you'll most likely interfere with your fellow amateur's who will most likely come after you.
Does a UK amateur have to transmit his callsign regularly?
All the best
Simon
Quote from: simondale on April 24, 2011, 12:09:27 PM
Does a UK amateur have to transmit his callsign regularly?
All the best
Simon
Yes, at least once per individual contact and if in a continous contact, at least once every 15 minutes (unless the rules have changed since I got my ticket (some 30+ years ago!)).
The Immersion gear is well thought out, but proprietry (and expensive!) with little ability for end user configuration of data.
e.g. - I'd like to be able to read in the GPS data stream to a ground station for my own flavour of tracking.
Nigel.
Before I start let me explain that this is a discussion/exploration of what can/cannot be legaly used with and without an amateur licence. It in no way endorses the use or tries to convince anyone to use any equipment in an illegal maner. This, I feel, is a legitimate subject for discussion on a public forum. IMHO no one should feel constrained or intimidated in the pursuit of information/knowledge as there is no intent to persuade anyone to commit an illegal act. I fully understand the reluctance that some may feel to be open and frank in the light of recent events. Rather, it is a effort to ensure, as far as is practical, that the legal constraints are known and ones actions can then be guided by facts and not assumptions.
Waffle over.
As far as I can determine(please correct me with facts preferably backed with links):
1/ Only amateur radio licence holders can possibly legally use a LRS opperating on the 70cm band(430mHz to 440mHz).
2/ Searching through RSGB and OFCOM I can find no reference to FHSS(frequency hopping spread spectrum) transmission protocols relating to the use of the 70cm band. As its not specifically disallowed one can assume that it is allowed. To me the band looks to be set up as a channelised narrow band division of the available 10mHz and its organisation has been overtaken by the development of FHSS (although concieved in 1920's, I believe). Unless, there is some overarching regulation/law. I stand to be corrected.
3/ I would not wish anyone to intentionally/unintentionally antagonise other users of the band but doubt that anyone would even be aware of a CL given the FHSS, low power, remote location and intermittant opperation for short periods of time. Additionally, I understand that the CL scans that part of the band that it uses and discounts those areas that it detects are busy/in use(like the Hitek Aurora 9 2.4gHz Tx). Notwithstanding the forgoing, if it is conclusively shown to be illegal for a radio amateur licence holder to use a CL then that is that, wether it causes any interferance or not. But, see 4/ below. I will be seeking more technical info from BevRC on the operation of their system.
4/ As far as I can see large parts of the operating ethics and procedures along with the band plans within the allowed bands do not have the backing of law. In the main they are codes of practice. In fact in the RSGB documents they state that this is the case. Thus, if it is not illegal and causes no problems then why not use a CL even if it does not conform to a band plan code of practice?
5/ Call sign on contact. As a user of CL would not be seeking to contact anyone is it legally required. If positively proved that it is a requirement then it would not be impossible to interpose a divice in the PPM feed to the CL Tx module to insert a call sign - not that anyone would be able to interpret it due to the transmission type and codeing.
Those with factual information please respond as this is a quest for enlightenment not someone trying to stir up trouble. Although, I have acted as devils advocate in some areas.
Reference links:
http://www.rsgb.org/operating/bandplans/ (http://www.rsgb.org/operating/bandplans/)
http://www.rsgb.org/spectrumforum/vhfuhf/432mhz.php (http://www.rsgb.org/spectrumforum/vhfuhf/432mhz.php)
http://www.rsgb.org/operating/ethics/ (http://www.rsgb.org/operating/ethics/)
Shame my Chainlink is also faulty, will contact seller for a refund ASAP. :(
Cheap chinese rubbish.
Quote from: simondale on April 24, 2011, 01:18:16 AM
I'm very pleased to say that FirstPersonView.co.uk supplies all its EzUHF units on 459MHz and one hundred mW.
The firmware came through very recently and our versions all ship like this. :-)
Here's the link: http://www.firstpersonview.co.uk/rc-control-systems/ezuhf-459mhz-fhss-robust-digital-rc-system (http://www.firstpersonview.co.uk/rc-control-systems/ezuhf-459mhz-fhss-robust-digital-rc-system)
Simon, good to hear this at last. From a theoretical viewpoint, what sort of range is expected from the 459MHz UK version in comparison to the standard version? Does it still have the high power switch to be used in an emergency due to loss of control?
Thanks, Mick
Hi Mick,
On the range; I think the theoretical maximum of the normal version (based on RSSI at 10km and then predicted range based on that) is about 100km. So I would have thought even at 20dBm (100 milliwatts) the system will give far more range than we could ever legally use in the UK (in terms of LOS specified in the ANO), and far more range than your video system would ever give you.
The low power switch is there but toggles between 18.5dBm in low power (about 71 milliwatts) and 20dBm in full power (100 milliwatts). We couldn't have the system transmit over 100 milliwatts or else it would not be allowed but I'd certainly recommend flying on low power most of the time, so that you can flick to high power in the event of a problem.
All the best
Simon
Quote from: simondale on April 23, 2011, 09:42:27 AM
Its just not worth the risk. 35MHz with a Corona RP8D1 receiver will give you up to a maximum of 1.5kms. That's as far, or beyond, as far as the eye can see and therefore as far as you are allowed to FPV by law.
Simon, my experience of 35Mhz was not a plain sailing as this.
On two completely independent 35Mhz setups (Futaba/Corona) - ie. different Tx, Rx, Plane, motor, esc, battery - the only reused things were my Vtx and GoPro, I had frequent twitching on all channels at all ranges, from sitting in front of me to 300m out where they became so intense I always turned back. I found that dropping the radio voltage from 6V to 5V stopped the close range twitching, but instead I got mid range (200m) twitching on all channels and complete loss of signal fail safes at 500m for several seconds, nearly losing the plane twice. Model was still within LOS and I just felt like a passenger.
IMHO, that is not worth the risk.
very happy with mine so far and i have tested it upto 1.2km. i couldnt even get it to go out of range on micro mode after walking the length of two football field next to water going infront of houses.
was just wondering what i should protect the antenna with? im using straws at the moment.
cheers
Cortex
Cortex, are you using the ChainLink or the 459EzUHF? We had a bit of thread drift along the route.
Quote from: electricmick on June 24, 2011, 10:04:03 PM
Cortex, are you using the ChainLink or the 459EzUHF? We had a bit of thread drift along the route.
chainlink uhf m8 :D
Quote from: paulca on June 07, 2011, 06:04:59 PM
Quote from: simondale on April 23, 2011, 09:42:27 AM
Its just not worth the risk. 35MHz with a Corona RP8D1 receiver will give you up to a maximum of 1.5kms. That's as far, or beyond, as far as the eye can see and therefore as far as you are allowed to FPV by law.
Simon, my experience of 35Mhz was not a plain sailing as this.
On two completely independent 35Mhz setups (Futaba/Corona) - ie. different Tx, Rx, Plane, motor, esc, battery - the only reused things were my Vtx and GoPro, I had frequent twitching on all channels at all ranges, from sitting in front of me to 300m out where they became so intense I always turned back. I found that dropping the radio voltage from 6V to 5V stopped the close range twitching, but instead I got mid range (200m) twitching on all channels and complete loss of signal fail safes at 500m for several seconds, nearly losing the plane twice. Model was still within LOS and I just felt like a passenger.
IMHO, that is not worth the risk.
I wonder what was going on there. I don't get any glitching on any of my 13 models with Corona RP8D1s in them and Futaba T7CP and T9CP transmitters. Perhaps something in your aircraft gives off RF that caused your Corona's to get upset - possibly a brushless motor/ ESC giving off noise on 35MHz? Or possibly there was some conductive interference going on from the ESC.
I had a weird problem which I thought was my receiver 6 months ago. I lost control once. After trying a couple of receivers I discovered that if I even touched the crystal holder the servos would chatter. None of my other radios did that so I sent it in to Ripmax. Basically I'd damaged the PCB inside, probably by carrying my Tx in a rucksack a couple of times. £40 repair and its good as gold again now. And I won't ever carry it in a rucksack again!
All the best
Simon