BMFA "A" & "B" Multirotor certs

[Loopdreams]

I will never take the tests. Reason? I will not fly my Hexacopter on manual. It's not fun;  it's too expensive in terms of the damage and the learning curve.

That seems a weird perspective, a lot of incidents could be avoided if people were confident flying in manual (flyaways, compass issues etc), so it could potentially be much more expensive NOT to learn to fly in manual.

If you only have a large/expensive multi, you can buy/build a very very cheap quad to practice with (certainly under £100, probably even less - there are some very cheap RTF micro quads which have manual modes, my son has a nanoQX and I'm sure there are much cheaper clones which would be ideal for practicing indoor on rainy days with almost no risk of damage to either quad or furniture), and if you take things steady and are discipline you should be able to learn to fly in manual from the ground up with few or no crashes.

I completely understand a lot of people are not interested in passing tests, but feel everyone should at least have a go at these manouvres, in manual mode, purely as a learning exercise, it cannot fail to improve your flying skills, which surely is what everyone is trying to achieve rather than stagnating and just doing what you did last month because its easy.

I don't think you're understanding what is meant by manual vs stabilised modes in this context.

It relates only to how the pitch and roll controls operate and has nothing at all to do with GPS or compasses.  Manual (or rate) mode means that e.g. if you hold left aileron then it will keep rolling left until you centre the stick and then it will stay in that same angle.  In stabilised mode full aileron will roll the craft to a preset angle and when the stick is moved back to centre it will roll level again.  Most of the RTF micro quads only have stabilised modes.

I only fly in manual but I only fly quads FPV.  But I think it's safer to fly a quad LOS (though I've always been massively confused by the appeal of that anyway) in stabilised mode.   They aren't helicopters and orientation can be much trickier, knowing that you can always centre the sticks and gain height seems a good way to avoid some accidents.

[Heliotrope]

I guess it depends what floats your boat. I have "manual" disabled on my multi-rotors used for AP. I have no use for anything other than Atti and GPS modes and rely heavily on Atti mode. I respect people who can fly well in manual mode, but AP work is all about being steady, which isn't easy in manual mode - at least not for me.

[Paul881]

You both make good points and I can see the logic in your arguments but I would suggest that flying a small quad manually is not the same as flying a hex or oct manually.

There is no comparing flying my F550 in ATT mode in terms of safety compared to me flying a micro quad manually around my living room. The fact that I can do the latter does not make me believe for one minute that I can fly my F550 in anything other than GPS or ATT mode. Yes there are flyaways, and compass issues but switching to manual mode unless you are very experienced at flying manual with that craft is not something I would like to do.

And I can't see the value of the test if it's just to get a certificate after which you then revert to the craft you really want to fly, that you never fly in manual mode, which is very different in characteristic to the craft you passed the test with.

But Big T's suggestion about the A test allowing the use of a stabilised flight for multirotor would be a positive step.

[Paul881]

I guess it depends what floats your boat. I have "manual" disabled on my multi-rotors used for AP. I have no use for anything other than Atti and GPS modes and rely heavily on Atti mode. I respect people who can fly well in manual mode, but AP work is all about being steady, which isn't easy in manual mode - at least not for me.

Me too, but I would like to have an accreditation for safe flying in those modes and so I think being excluded from the tests on that basis is an opportunity missed for the BMFA.

[Paul881]

I think it's safer to fly a quad LOS (though I've always been massively confused by the appeal of that anyway) in stabilised mode.   They aren't helicopters and orientation can be much trickier, knowing that you can always centre the sticks and gain height seems a good way to avoid some accidents.

I completely agree.

[heisenburg]

In some ways fancy flight controllers are damaging the hobby they allow everybody to buy big fancy crafts, and at the end of the day , it's so company's can make money selling things. Rarely bought a huge 5000 pound plane and hurt somebody in the old days because there wallet and brain said they were not capable , now a fancy controller says anybody can do it.

I hate tests licences but unfortunately some people are the Hobbes worst enemy. If they said example it is against the law to fly a multi rotor that weights > 800g all in until you had passed a test and then > 1.5kg until you passed another.

Surely this would teach people a little respect and make sure that people with machines that frankly can be dangerous in the wrong hands. And in turn take pressure of hobbyists with some respect and skills

Don't shoot me just my opinion

[Gundummy]

[PotNoodle]

... Yes there are flyaways, and compass issues but switching to manual mode unless you are very experienced at flying manual with that craft is not something I would like to do.

And I can't see the value of the test if it's just to get a certificate after which you then revert to the craft you really want to fly, that you never fly in manual mode, which is very different in characteristic to the craft you passed the test with...

But that's the point, you have to have the experience before you can pass the test.

I recently passed my A test for planks, flying purely manual LOS even tho I have no real interest in LOS flying. I did it partly so that I could fly solo at the local club but mostly so that if everything went pear shaped I could still recover the model. It took a bit of effort but I'm really happy I did it. I had been flying home made foamies and multis for a while but I still went ahead and trained for the A

Now, it's true that it's very unlikely something will fail and I will suddenly need to fly a multi in manual mode but I still plan to do the multi A. On that weird & unusual day (taking off in the wrong mode?) I will know I can cope. As a bonus, the coffin dodgers at my local club won't be able to complain ;) Producing a BMFA A cert may also shutdown any 'jobsworths' who complain about me flying guerilla style

I can't see a downside to taking the A for multis so why not do it?

[Paul881]

I can't see a downside to taking the A for multis so why not do it?

Because its not relevant to the way I fly my multi and if I'm doing it just to pass a test on a craft that is different in flight characteristics, whats the value of it?

To be clear, I would like to do the test and on my F550 Hex but not in manual mode.